The Commission Code for Success

Talk That Sells, Patrick Donadio

• The Commission Code For Success from Sims Training and Consulting, LLC • Season 1

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Ever feel like your message is solid, but it still doesn’t land? We sat down with communication expert Patrick Donadio to unpack a simple, field-tested system that turns everyday conversations into trust, clarity, and action. Patrick’s IMPACT model—Intention, Message/Method, Person, Activate, Clarify, Transform—gives you a practical way to prepare, deliver, and follow through so buyers feel heard and decisions come faster.

We start by reframing the goal: don’t push to sell, help people buy. That shift changes everything from your opening line to your closing question. You’ll learn how to set a clean intention, choose the right channel, and tailor your message to the person in front of you—analytical, relational, introvert, or extrovert—using the Platinum Rule. Patrick shows why underpromising and overdelivering builds trust, and how consistency turns one-off wins into long-term relationships.

Then we dive into the hard part: listening. Most prospects think three times faster than you can speak, creating a “brain gap” that derails attention. We cover how to use eye contact without being awkward, build a ten-question discovery toolkit, and apply internal summaries to stay present. You’ll hear practical ways to clarify meaning—summaries, confirmations, and precise follow-ups—so you and your client end the call aligned on needs, next steps, and success metrics.

If you want fewer mixed signals and more yeses, this conversation gives you the tools to diagnose before you prescribe and to communicate in a way that feels respectful, timely, and effective. Enjoy the insights, then block ten minutes on your calendar to ask two questions: what did I do well, and what will I do differently next time? Subscribe, share with a teammate, and leave a review to let us know which tactic you’ll try first.

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Speaker:

On the other side of the coin, you talk with somebody who's, you know, very relational. They're talking about themselves and about the fun they had this weekend. You know, you don't want to overwhelm them with statistics and data, right? So you want to take a piece of information like, you know, um, we have about a 30%, you know, return rate when people use our product. For example, now that's going to tune them in when you say, for example, they don't care about the 30%. But for example, and then you tell them a little case study story. So that the personality is one of the parts about building a deep relationship. The other part is, right, you do what you say you're going to do.

Speaker 1:

Welcome to the Commission Code Podcast. We're here to help you overcome the challenges that most of us face in our business from time to time. You know, it seems like feeling like you're on a plateau. You just need to need to grow your business or maybe feeling overwhelmed, it's kind of big in the meeting, yet it seems like you're always working. Nothing seems to be working anymore. We want to help you solve those problems and many more. Our objective is to provide you with practical solutions so you can grow your business and have more time to enjoy the fruits of your labor. My name is Morris and I'm going to be your host for this show. It's been years, okay, decades really. In the corporate world, teaching business owners how to increase their revenue and use professional sales process and run their business more effectively and efficiently. I started my own consulting and training business developments ago against people. I'm helping my clients do just exactly that. Get more revenue, increase their revenue, and have more time to enjoy the fruits of their labor. I gotta tell you, I'm having more fun than ever helping people build successful businesses. So, with all that said, let's get on with today's episode of the Commission Code for your success. Patrick Donadio is our guest today on the Commission Code. And it's exciting to have Patrick on here with us because Patrick is a communication expert and he's gonna share some ideas with us and things that probably you don't think about a lot, but probably you should. So, Patrick, thank you. Welcome to the show. Morris, great to be here, my friend. It's this is gonna be fun. I've uh I came to the conclusion early in my career that if I didn't do a better job of speaking in front of groups of people, uh, I was never gonna climb that proverbial corporate ladder. Sure enough, I got a coach. He's been my friend now for 40 years, and uh boy, without him I would never have made it.

Speaker:

Yeah. We all need help. I've got a coach too, so I mean every coach should have a coach. I think it's a great, uh, great tool.

Speaker 1:

Oh, it really is, and especially when it comes to communication, because there's so many different aspects of it. I mean, you've written a great book about communicating with impact, and boy, I'll tell you what, that's what it's all about. It's all about creating understanding, right?

Speaker:

Yes, of course. And you know, we spend 80% of our waking day in some form of communication, yet many of us just take it for granted. We don't even think about it sometimes. But it's really an important component of everyday life, whether you work at home or family, friends, or clients, it's all all about communicating.

Speaker 1:

It really is. Even even between uh a married couple. I mean again, my my coach says uh commitment uh brings a relationship together, but it's communication that gives it life. And I love that line. I think that's cool. Yeah. It just it's amazing how it uh really does have an impact in everything that we do, especially in business. If uh if we're not able to communicate our value to the people we're working with, and you know, it's all gonna fall apart, right?

Speaker:

I I agree a hundred percent. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

So tell us what you do to help people communicate better.

Speaker:

Well, you know, Morris, I've been a communicator almost all my life. Um even in high school, I did the morning announcements. I was always in front of groups and being a talker, but I didn't really understand this, not just about communicating, it's about communicating with impact. And that means there's a little bit of a science behind it. So I've come up with a process, and if you don't mind, I'd maybe just start out with the six steps that I think are really critical for every effective communication, and then we can just dive in and talk about any of the steps because I really I'm really here today to help your listeners get better at communicating, you know, build better relationships, make more money, you know, and all those fun things. So let me give you, I'll give you a quick rundown. And I created this, uh it's an acronym, and I know people go, oh, acronym, oh my god, but it's really I worked real hard to make the acronym actually important. It's not just words that make up the spelling of the acronym. So the word impact, you know, the six keys. And so I'll run through them pretty quickly and then we can dive into any of those you like. So the I is the intention, right? Every communication starts with a thought. So think before you speak. And this is a step that I think a lot of people just skip. They just want to jump into communicating when I'll take in that 30 seconds and say, what's my intention? The M is the message and the method. So once you know what your intention is, what's the right method? Because there's a lot of tools you can use, but not every tool is going to work effectively depending on your intention. And then what's the message, right? We're gonna we talk a lot about having a very clear, crisp, and concise message, making sure you have a compelling opening, make sure you have a, you know, a powerful closing. They're all important, whether it's a presentation, an email, or you're just having a conversation. That's the M step. The P is the person, so everybody's different. So don't just assume that I can say the same thing to everybody. You know, you and I are totally different. Uh, we have different personality styles, different experiences, different educational levels. So when you're communicating, you want to personalize your message to the receiver. So that's the P step. So we got the IMP, the IM planning, that's the first half of the process. The ACT, the second half is all about how do you act, right? So how do you activate this message? And in the activate step, which is A for activate, we talk about both active engagement and active listening. And that's both you being present and you helping others stay present. And so the active part is really critical. And I know we were talking in our pre-call about active listening, so I would love to share some insights if you want to talk about that. C is clarify. So even though we've done a good job communicating, you know what? If we both don't get the same message, we haven't really communicated. So you want to make sure that you and I are hearing and saying the same things. And I like to remind people that the meaning of the message doesn't come from the sender, it comes from the receiver. So we think, oh yeah, I was very clear, it's not my fault. Well, it is your fault because in my my philosophy is if they don't get it, it's my fault. It's not always the other person's responsibility. So C is clarified. And then the last step of the process is a secret sauce. I call it transform. And so, how do you transform this communication, these words, into the intention you set? So it all comes back to the intention. What do you want to have happen? What do you want people to think, do, or feel? How do you make sure that whatever you want them to think, do, or feel, they are thinking, doing, and feeling? And so we talk about two types of transformations. There's the external transformation that I think most people know about, but there's another part of that, which is the internal transformation that a lot of people don't understand. And I dive into that as well. So that's it. That's a six-step process. It's not that complicated. It's easy to love. It's only six keys. But the complicated part is doing it. It's like, you know, putting these things into practice. It's like, I know that, but the question is, are you doing it? So if you're listening right now and you're driving, don't take out a pen. But if you're, you know, sitting somewhere, I would hope that maybe in our short time together, you pick up one or two things you could put into practice because that's what I'm here for. That's my paycheck today. If you get a good idea and you use it, I'm gonna feel great. So let me turn it back to you, Morris, and you just drive the conversation and we'll go wherever you like. Oh, it sounds great, Patrick.

Speaker 1:

I I love your six steps, man. That's that is about as clear uh a process as I can think of, a system that that allows you to actually gain understanding with the person you're working with and get to that sixth step of transformation, which is the whole the whole purpose behind it. If yeah, if that doesn't happen, then it's not worth worth the time and effort. That's for sure. When when when you're working with folks, how do you help them implement this? Because you said it, Patrick, and you're absolutely right. There's so many things that, gee, I know I should do this, gee, I know that's what I'm supposed to do, but then uh I don't do it.

Speaker:

Yeah. Well, I think the first step to change is awareness, right? Um, I'm I'm also a trained coach. I'm a speaker and a trainer and a coach. Uh, and I've been certified in both speaking and coaching. So I spend a lot of time learning about the key tools to help people transform. And when it comes to change, and it comes to individual change, you know, there's a simple model that I like to talk about. And that is um, if you're not aware of something, you can't change it. So, what I encourage people to do is to spend a little bit of time each week trying to think about the week and ask yourself two questions. What did I do well this week? And what could I do differently next week? So you begin to create the awareness. And you might say, for example, you know what? I there were so many times I realized that I wasn't really clear and people were asking me a lot of questions and wasn't like getting my message across. But you're not gonna know that unless you take a little bit of time. So if you're listening right now, if you could do me a big favor and when you finish listening to the podcast, look on your calendar and block out 10 minutes somewhere in the next few days and just 10 minutes for you and ask yourself, what am I doing well when it comes to communicating and leading and growing my business? And what can I be doing differently? So that's the first step, Morris. Create that awareness. Then the second step is if you are aware of something and it's working, keep doing it. If you're aware of something and it's not working, then do something different, right?

Speaker 1:

So so uh doctor, it hurts when I do this. Well, then I love that.

Speaker:

Then don't do that. Yeah. So uh, so in terms of how do you do it, it's like we got to be a continuous learning person. You know, I think we all need to think about we're always getting better. So uh to me, that's the first step, create that awareness. You know, and uh we were talking about coaching, and we both have coaches, you know, what coaching's really simple. It's about where are you now? Where would you like to be? And the coach is gonna help you get there. So you can coach yourself if you want. I mean, it's obviously harder, but you could do it by saying, Where am I now? What are my current skill sets? What's working for me? What am I good at? Where would I like to be six months from now or a year from now? What can I get better at? And then you want to just come up with a plan to move from here to there. So that's kind of how you put it into practice.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, and that plan is is so vitally important. We actually think that through and come up with specific things that you have control over that you can do better at that that too is, I think, one of the key points. We worry about stuff that we don't have any control over. It's like sales. Uh if all I'm worried about is how many sales I make or how much money I make from the sale, right? I don't control that. People choose or to or choose not to buy. Right. I don't control that, but I do control how I communicate the value and the offer that I'm making. And that's where this all comes into play, isn't it? Right.

Speaker:

Yeah, and I do control the relationship that I build, I do control how I can increase the trust level. I do control, so it's not where you, you know, like you can't control maybe the outcome, but you can control the process. Absolutely. The little things you do, right? And you and I know we've been doing this a long time. In my opinion, it's all about relationships, right? People buy from people they like, know, and trust. So um, if you don't have a good relationship, if you're not building a good relationship, then you're not going to probably get the kind of business. And it's not just about getting the business, it's about keeping the business, getting repeat business. And that's where the impact process comes into play. For example, even if we just take a look at personality style, right? In the P step. I mean, you have people that are very introverted, you have people that are very extroverted, you have people that are very analytical, people that are very relational. So when you meet somebody, if you're not the same style, you want to practice the golden rule, which is treat people the way they want to be treated, then you're not going to be effective. See, I don't believe in the golden rule when it comes to building your business. I believe in the platinum rule. And do you know the platinum rule, Morris? I I think I do, but you tell me. Yeah, it's treat people the way they want to be treated, right? So if I'm working with somebody who's very extroverted, and and by the way, I'm not. So, but I will know then, hey, I got to take it down a notch. I got to make sure that I slow it down. I got to make sure that I don't talk all the time. Maybe I want to pull them out a little bit because that's gonna build that relationship. So knowing your own strengths and areas you can improve on, for example, with your personality style, is one way to build those relationships. And that's you know, that's like the P step. So again, all these things come back to these six key components that I've found over the years really make for effective communication. And effective communication makes for deeper relationships, and deeper relationships makes for more clients.

Speaker 1:

Oh, yeah. I mean, it's it's those three questions. You know, uh, can I trust you? Do you care about me? Right. And do you know your stuff? Yeah, you know, that's the the third step, and the first two are so much more important than the third.

Speaker:

Exactly. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

You know, it just all comes down to that. And personality style, understanding that is is so very, I think, very important because as you say, if I'm speaking to somebody who is very analytical, for example, yes, and all I'm doing is talking theoretical and I'm talking, you know, 50,000 foot level, boy, howdy, he's more interested or she's more interested in the facts and the numbers than than in uh you know all the platitudes I can produce. So yeah, I better understand that and get to the heart of the matter pretty quick, right?

Speaker:

Right. So I would say for people, you don't need to go out and take a personality profile, which would be helpful, but at least you need to be more aware. So when you're meeting somebody, you know, as you're having the conversation, start to think about how are we similar and how are we different. So if you're talking with somebody and they're asking lots of deep questions and a lot of, you know, um, whys and all those kind of things, probably you're you're talking with an analytical. So you want to make sure you come back with, you know, facts and statistics and real examples. They may want a story, but they don't want you to tell like a bunch of stories because that's gonna just bore them. On the other side of the coin, you talk with somebody who's, you know, very relational, they're talking about, you know, themselves and about the fun they had this weekend. You know, you don't want to overwhelm them with statistics and data, right? So you want to take a piece of information like, you know, um, we have about a 30%, you know, return rate when people use our product. For example, now that's gonna tune them in when you say, for example, they don't care about the 30%. But for example, and then you tell them a little case study story. So that the personality is one of the parts about building a deep relationship. The other part is right, you do what you say you're gonna do. Right, integrity. Oh, yeah. If if you that's the kind of the transformation, if you promise something and don't deliver. So years ago, Morris, just for me, for example, I'm an extrovert, and one of the biggest challenges I had is overpromising. I would like to say, I could do that, I could do that. Yeah, I'm a people pleaser. That's part of being a relational extrovert, is that your people pleasers are out there and we want to make everybody happy. And I learned very, very quickly that I needed to, whatever I thought I was gonna say, I needed to like stop and then add maybe another two days or three days to it because underpromise, overdeliver is way better than overpromise, under deliver. But again, these are some of the lessons we learn, right? From our experiences of being an entrepreneur or of being a 1099 person.

Speaker 1:

Oh, isn't that the truth? It just it's amazing, and it's interesting to me how how it has changed over the years. When when I first got into sales back in 1984, golly damn, I'm old, bad. I am old, it's terrible. Anyway, we we were taught sell yourself, sell the company, and then sell the product. And nowhere in there did they say, you better make a create a relationship, you better get to know this person and find out what they need and what's going on in their mind.

Speaker:

Yeah, you know, the big change I've learned over the years is that you know, people think, and hopefully they don't think this way anymore, but there are some that still do that selling is about telling, you know, it's about talking, it's about convincing. To me, I mean, years ago, somebody said to me, you know, um, whatever's on your business card, scratch out that and put this title, problem solver. Yeah, because we are we are basically in the problem-solving business. People hire us to fix or or solve their problem. So the first thing you got to do is diagnose before you prescribe. You don't want to just start prescribing, which a lot of people do, like, hey, we got the best of this, we got the best that. No, selling to me, and I've learned this the hard way because an extrovert, I love to talk, is about asking good questions, diagnosing, finding out what their challenges are, what their needs are, finding out how to make this a good fit. And then you can prescribe, right?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, totally, totally. I mean, if I don't do a good job of discovery, I can't do a very good job of creating recommendations that are gonna help you solve your problem and transform to get you to whatever that end result is you want. Right. You know, Zig Ziglar taught us all this stuff and we didn't Oh yeah. I love that guy. Guy rest his soul. You know, it's just it's it's amazing. The more people you help get what they want, the more you're gonna get what you want. I mean, I screwed that up, I'm sure, but it's still the same, the same concept there. It's all about helping the other people get what they want, not about how many blue widgets I sell this week. And and that's the that's the problem I see with a number of the folks that that I coach from time to time is man, Patrick, I sell blue widgets. Now I know you might have a green one, but you don't have a blue one. Let me tell you about a blue widget, and I've got a case of them in the trunk. You won't want to. Yeah, no, I it's just that's that's I call it amateur sales. Yes, yes, that's what it boils down to. It's amateur versus professional. And if I'm a professional salesperson, I'm here to help you get what you want.

Speaker:

Right. And love Zig Ziggler, you know, I I've met him a few times at our National Speakers Association years ago. And another quote that I like, Morris, is people don't care how much you know until they know how much you care, right? Talking about relationships. So uh let's just talk about the intention stuff for just a moment, right? Before you have any conversation, you want to know what's my intention. If you're with a prospect, your intention is to start a relationship. It's not to close. Now, if they say I'm gonna buy, I'm not gonna no, no, I can't buy because I can't sell you because I'm not at that. No, feel free if they want to buy, sell them. But if you start with the intention, then I'm gonna have coffee with Mary so that I can learn more about what she needs and begin a relationship and let her know what we could offer so that maybe we could have another conversation, right? Everybody wants instant generation. We all want everything to happen at once. It's I call it event thinking. But good communicators understand it's a process, right? It's process, so it means it's it takes time. So, like the first step, if anybody's having a any call or meeting this week with a potential prospect, take 30 seconds and ask, ask yourself this question why am I having this meeting with this person at this time? And what do I want them to think, do, or feel when we finish this interaction? And then you have that statement, and then that drives everything you're gonna do for that first interaction.

Speaker 1:

Oh, yeah. I mean, it's 100%. If the if the mindset isn't correct walking into the the sales situation, uh they're gonna know if if all I care about is is quote unquote making a sale, because we don't make sales, people buy. Right. If all I'm thinking about is making the sale because the mortgage is due or the light bill has to be paid, your prospect can tell that the people you're working with can see it in your face and your eyes and your tone of voice and everything else that goes on there.

Speaker:

Yeah, and that goes back, that's your intention, right? Because your intention drives everything. And the thing is, you know what? You don't you have an intention whether you know it or not. So why not spend a few minutes and know it? Because we always have an intention. For example, if I'm really struggling, I gotta make this sale. You know, they I'm gonna come off as very needy, I'm gonna come off as maybe a little too pushy, and they're gonna pick up on that. So I love what you said because I think it was Jeffrey Gittimer. Do you know Jeffrey Gittimer? I know the name, and I've uh Jeffrey's wife on the show. Yeah, he he's a big sales guy, and he he said, um you don't sell, you just help people buy. Absolutely. That's an intention. Like if I'm the intention is to sell them, or is my intention to help them buy? If you have an intention to help them buy, then you're gonna come at it with a whole different perspective. So that's the eye for the intention that goes back to the mindset, right? Uh yeah.

Speaker 1:

I mean, when when when I teach sales, I I I don't even call it the the C L O S E word anymore. Uh it's it I title it helping people make a decision.

Speaker:

There you go.

Speaker 1:

You know, because because that's what it really boils down to. And I really don't care whether they say yes or no if I'm if I have the right mindset. I don't care whether they say yes or no because I know that one sale isn't going to make or break my career. I'm more interested in helping them get what they want. If I can't provide it, can I help them find a place where they can, right? Uh where they can get it. So it it always boils back down to that intention and why you're there in the first place.

Speaker:

Yeah, yeah. And and then another piece that's important, if we want to really think of ourselves as problem solvers and you want to be good at diagnosing, then guess what? You have to be good at listening. Yes. Because if people are talking and you're thinking about, I can't wait from the shut up because I want to tell them about these three wonderful methods. No, so listening is a very important part. And I think for a lot of years, you know, salespeople thought it was all about the talking and not about the listening. So if you don't mind, Morris, let's take a few minutes. I think you mentioned at the beginning of our call, um, listening was an important skill. So let's take a few minutes and talk about that. Is that okay with you?

Speaker 1:

Oh, absolutely. It's it's probably the most critical part of the whole thing, past walking in with the right intention, is is then building that relationship. I'm not gonna build a relationship with somebody if I'm not listening. And and they and they are the ones who tell me whether I am listening.

Speaker:

Right.

Speaker 1:

They're the ones that are gonna tell me whether I'm listening to them.

Speaker:

Yeah. So first let's talk about why it's hard to be a good listener. Well, I will tell you, Morris, I've done workshops for over two decades, and whenever I teach communication skills, I literally ask every audience the same question. I'll ask, raise your hand if you've had a 60-minute or longer formal listening skills training. And I get about 10% of the audience that raised their hands. 10, 90 of the people out there have never had any formal listening skills training. So it's a very important skill. So that's the first reason that we don't see people being good listeners. The second reason is because there's a genetic gap between half-ass people think and half-ass people speak. So genetically, it's hard to be a good listener because the average person thinks three times faster than you can speak. So while I'm talking to you, Morris, your brain's clicking three times faster. So I say beep and your brain's going beep, beep, beep. So because you can think three times faster, there's a lot of space in there to get you to be distracted. So you need to be aware that it's really hard to be a good listener, not because you haven't had the training, although that would help. But if you understand the fact that you can think faster, then you want to use the gap between how fast someone's speaking and how fast someone's thinking to keep their attention. So that's the biggest challenge. So now you've got like the roadblock. So let's come up with a couple tools to help you become a better listener, right? Okay. So I'm just curious, what would you say is the best thing you've learned? Because I'm gonna pick on you for a second. You're an expert. What's one thing you found that helps you become a better listener?

Speaker 1:

Eye contact without being creepy. Okay. I've got a seven-year-old grandson, Patrick, and he he talks to me and he's doing this the whole time. He's just looking around the room, you know. And I've I've been telling you, you've got to look at me. So he came in last week and he sat down in my office, which is what he does. He comes to visit my office, and he he sat down, and it was one of these where his eyes were wide open and he was just staring at me. Yeah. And I said, What are you doing? He says, We're having a staring contest. Yeah. And we don't do that. That's creepy. He said, Yeah, I know it is kind of creepy, isn't it, Dad? And and that's that's the whole thing. But that eye contact, I think, is is one of the basics. It it says I'm listening to you.

Speaker:

Yes, yes. And and let's talk about why that's important. One, because it does help you build a connection, right? And two, because a lot of the message is not just your words. People are communicating with a lot of their body and their tone. So if you're just listening for the words, you're not going to get the whole message. So eye contact's going to give you a little bit of a cue, a clue. Like if they're talking with you and all of a sudden, you know, the you see them kind of slump or you see them, you know, pulling back a little bit nonverbally, it's like, well, something's happening here. So eye contact is really helpful to build a relationship, but it's also helpful to get the entire message. So that's a very, very important tip. And you know, the thing that I just did with you, Morris, is a tip that I think is a great active listening tip: asking questions. Amen. So I asked you the question first because I wanted to model for you that a good listener doesn't just have to sit back. A good listener can ask questions. So asking questions are helpful. Open-ended questions, closed-ended questions. So every great salesperson, in fact, every great leader, should have a good question toolbox. So let me give an example. I'm going to give you a question and you tell me if it's an open or closed-ended question. Um can you tell me more about the Smith account? Oh, that's somewhat open-ended. Yeah, yeah. Well, it's kind of about if you're an extrovert, you can say yes. You can say no. That's true. Well, it's a disguised open-ended question. So it goes.

Speaker 1:

Patrick, wait a minute. That's that's an attorney question. What time is it? No, or no, no. The question is, do you have the time? Right. And the answer to the question is yes or no, as far as an attorney is concerned. Whereas most of us will go, sure, it's 10 42. Right. And you know, I don't care about how the watch is built, I just want to know what time it is. Yeah. You know, it's amazing.

Speaker:

So I think the idea of having good questions and knowing like which questions are which. So for for extroverts, every question is open.

unknown:

Right.

Speaker:

Yeah. So you want to be using maybe a little more close-ended questions. But introverts, if you ask an introvert, you know, can you tell me more about the Smith account or can you what time what what time do you have? They're gonna do you have the time, they're gonna say yes. So, introverts, you want to really bring a more broad perspective question. Like, um, tell me about the prospect, tell me about your challenge. They can't say yes or no. You know, so so open-ended questions, closed-ended questions, um, questions that are empowering questions. So, again, if you're in uh listening today as a salesperson or as a leader, I would just say one of your homework assignments is to come up with your top 10 questions. What are the top 10 questions to help you become more involved and focused on learning about the other person and identifying what their needs are? So, questions is a good part of being a good listener. Another tool that I like, and I've used this tool a lot as a coach, I call it the internal summary. So, I mean, people know about summarizing, which I think people do, and that's a good tool. So, let's talk about summaries for just a moment. I'm gonna give you three examples of summaries. One is you summarize, right? So, hey, great to have call with you, Morris. So it sounds like you want me to help you, blank, blank, and blank. That's what I call the other person summary. Another way to reverse that that I think we use as a coach is called the you summary technique. And you say, hey Morris, you know what? Just to make sure I understand you correctly, can I um let me just share what I think we're gonna be doing next. And then I summarize. And as I'm summarizing and I hear them going yes, or they go, well, no, not really. Then I'm gonna know if I really hit the message. A third technique, and this is one you do throughout the interaction, particularly as an extrovert, is you do an internal summary to help you stay focused. So you know that your brain's clicking three times faster. There's a gap there that makes it hard to pay attention. So one way to pay attention is to do what I call the internal summary. So as you're talking to me, I'm repeating a couple keywords in my own head to help me stay focused. I'm having a really difficult day. I'm saying, I had a difficult day. Yeah, you know, I just got this new client and they're really disappointed, they're disappointed. So you're using this gap to kind of repeat some of these keywords that they're saying to you into your head to help you stay present. And then if you get to a point where you're like, oh my gosh, I don't know what that means in your head, then you can maybe stop at a good point and say, Hey, um, excuse me, can I ask you a quick question? I was a little bit confused, and then you can ask a question. Now, what you don't want to do is what a lot of people do is they interrupt and they they never let the other person finish their sentences. So I just thought I'd share a couple like tools for your toolbox on being a good listener.

Speaker 1:

Oh, I and I think questions are probably the most important part of the whole deal. And as you say, so many of us in sales, we we were brought up or we've been thinking that it's all about me presenting, it's all about me telling you what I need to tell you. I've got this whole list of stuff that I've got to uh cover. Uh I hate that word. And I've got to tell you all this stuff. And and if you, you know, you're ready to buy before I get done. Well, no, we can't do that yet. I've got still five more things I need to tell you. It's it's like I have taught uh travel advisors for for a number of years, and you know, it's oh, I need to tell you everything I know about this destination, but the prospect already told you they want to buy an alligator. Yeah, if they want to buy a damn alligator, sell them a damn alligator. Right and let's move on here. Get them what they want. But asking those questions, I think, is is key. And uh a friend of mine, Bob Berg, you may know Bob. Oh, yeah, I know Bob. Uh just a really super guy. He published recently and gave away his 10, his top 10 questions. And I read the list and it's like, yep, that one, that, oh, I love this. And you know, it starts with, gee, Patrick, tell me how you got started in this business. Right. And that to me is just you want somebody to start talking, a business person to start talking. Boy, howdy, you're gonna learn a lot when you ask them that question, especially if you're interested in the answer.

Speaker:

Right. And that's a great open-ended question to help you learn a little bit more about the person. And sometimes when you have something that big and broad, you may get information you would have never gotten. So absolutely. Those are good questions. Right. Questions to start the conversation, questions to redirect the conversation, questions to move the conversation forward. You know, these are all the kind of tools for your toolbox. And again, it's not just for you know 1099 folks, leaders, employees, if you're working in a company listening to the podcast, these are great tools for all of us to be working on. Even if you ask good questions, though, the step that I think is important in the C step is to clarify to make sure that we both got the same message. Yeah. So sometimes, sometimes asking clarification questions. So they might say, you know, um, I'm really, I really want something that's going to make my life better. Okay, he says that. Well, that's interesting. So when you say better, I'm sure what does that mean for you when you say better, right? Because you know, sometimes people aren't very specific, so we can ask good clarifying questions to make sure we understand exactly what they're thinking. Like, so Morris, if I said the word dog, what are you thinking right now?

Speaker 1:

Uh, my dog Maverick, who passed away a few years ago.

Speaker:

Okay. See, I'm hungry, so I was thinking hot dog, right? So, so yeah, so we the word has so many different meanings, and when you want to communicate effectively, you want to make sure that you're both on the same page. So clarification questions, which are different than you know, questions to get information, they're questions to get clarity, is another part of that steps of the six-step process. Because again, as I said early on, the meaning of the message doesn't come from the sender, it comes from the receiver. So you put the meaning to the message. I said the word dog, you thought of Maverick, God rest his soul. I thought of a hot dog. So we're we're both thinking differently.

Speaker 1:

So, what do you put on your hot dog?

Speaker:

Oh, I'm just a basic um ketchup mustard guy, you know. Yeah, we're I'm excited. We can talk about food. We'll have a whole nother podcast because I can tell you all about great food. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

I love it. I love it. Patrick, this has been a very, very interesting and very wonderful conversation. Now, communicating with impact, it's a great book. Where is it? It's available, I'm sure, on Amazon, right?

Speaker:

Yes, on Amazon, sure it is. And of course, it's on my website if people want an autograph copy. Uh, but I think to me, the most important part of our time together today is just to be aware of that, you know, to be a better communicator, it takes a conscious effort, right? Uh, and and the impact process, and if you want, I don't know, Morris. I mean, I'd be happy to put a little link in the show notes for PDF. They can just get the process at the six steps right there if they can. I'd be happy to put that in there for them. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you. And yeah, Patrick, thanks for taking the time to chat with us today. It's been great to have you on the show.

Speaker:

Well, it's my pleasure, Morris. I love that you're working with folks who are trying to make a living. And I just if I can wrap up very quickly, just to remind everybody, it's great that you had a chance to listen to both of us, but most important is what you're going to do when you leave in a few moments, right? So I end every program with the same thing that I tell people nothing changes until you change. So if you learned a great tool or idea from Morris or myself today, you know, jot it down when you get a chance and then put it into practice right away. And then most importantly, remember that everything we do is about getting better. So whenever you try it, remember the thing I said earlier, ask yourself two questions. What did I do well this time? And what can I do better the next time? And in this process, you're going to be more effective and hopefully make other people's lives greater. And that's how you make an impact, Morris.

Speaker 1:

Well said, my friend. Absolutely well said. Again, Patrick, thank you so much for being on the Commission Code today. We we may just have to do this again because I don't think we got finished. I'm happy to come back. That sounds great. Patrick, have a wonderful day. Thanks for being here. Thank you, Morris. Well, that does it for this episode of the Commission Code Podcast. This is the place where we want to help you find the Commission Code to success in your business. Remember, go to Morris Sims.com for more information. And in the meantime, hey, have a great week. Get out there and meet somebody new, and we'll see you again next time, right here on the Commission Code. Best wishes, I'm Morris Sims.